Wednesday
Jul092008
Why Jesse Why? ..."Cut his !#$ Off?" - Jesse Jr. Calls Daddy "Reckless", but Jesse MAY have a point ( GASP)
Wednesday, July 9, 2008 at 10:01PM The Blogmother What in the hot crispy heck? Come on Rev. Jackson Come on! Now I interviewed Jesse Jackson for ESSENCE.com. He AIN'T stupid. I don't care how many of y'all think he is. The man is intelligent, don't let that Green Eggs and Ham fool ya! But let's see, you're on the set at FOX and you're whispering? With a mic on? And that was an accident? I'm sorry Rev. you need more people.The Rev. Jesse Jackson apologized Wednesday for saying Barack Obama is “talking down to black people” during what Jackson thought was a private conversation before a FOX News interview Sunday.
Jackson was speaking to a guest at the time about Obama’s speeches in black churches and his support for faith-based charities. Jackson added before going live, “I want to cut his nuts off.”
Jackson apologized:
"Any hurt or harm I caused his campaign, I apologize, because I have such high regard for him," he said. "I cherish his role -- the role he's played in making the nation better and making the world rejoice."Jackson Had a Point
And for the record. I TOO am not happy with Barack Obama's penchant for pulling out cousin Pookie and Popeyes in front of Black audiences. This post Obama's "Tough Love" For the Black Community" basically chronicles what Obama says anytime he gets in front of a Black audience:
The black audiences at which he directs his “tough love” almost always respond with approval or applause, and his support among black voters has been rock-solid, regularly racking up 80 to 90 percent of the black vote during the Democratic primaries. Meanwhile, Obama is partaking in what’s basically tantamount to a long-running Sista Souljah campaign, demonstrating to white voters that he’s not beholden to the black community nor scapegoating whites for its ailments. So it’s ultimately a win-win. New York Magazine.
A win win for whom? So Black people get a good speech that they agree with, but what else do we get? What's behind door number 2 or 3? When he takes some other groups to task, in thier faces, then he can issue lectures to us. Its not the lecture I disagree with, its who gets a lecture vs who gets political pandering and campaign promises. He's running for President for all of America. There are plenty of lectures to go around.
So Yes, I have to agree he is talking "down" to Blacks. Sorry Obama acolytes. I'm calling it. Not because we don't need a-talking-to, but because he is running for President of the United States and I suspect his concern has more to do with using us to appeal to White voters than correcting our shortcomings. In other words, don't make me your "Sister Souljah" moment. He was not talking to US in that Father's Day speech. Sorry. He wasn't. His goal between now and November is to collect votes and appeal to "swing" voters. Black folks aren't swing voters... we've already swung to the tune of 90%
If you want to use that bully pulpit, use it for some other purpose than reinforcing stereotypes in the White community. For example, on Father's Day Obama could have easily used that opportunity to talk about the love of Black fathers. For example, Lavena Johnson's Father. His daughter went off to serve this nation in the US Army and her body was shipped back with signs of having been tortured and the Army appearing to have concocted a "suicide" to cover up her rape and murder. Talk about her father fighting the US government for answers three years after she is gone.
To be clear, some Black folks need a talking-to, but in the context of a political campaign where he has 90% of the Black vote, Barack Obama ain't talking to US. I don't have a problem with a lecture, but I have a problem with Black folks serving as his Sistah Souljah moment. If he really wants to "challenge" the Black community how about giving a speech on sexism and misogyny. I mean he has chastened us about homophobia, Popeyes Chicken, littering, and anti-intellectuallism... WHY NOT SEXISM??? I sure wish he would use one of those speeches to throw in a couple of lines about BLACK WOMEN AND GIRLS being exploited, ignored and abused, but we all know those Black audiences would probably stop clapping if he started speaking out about violence against Black women and girls. Obama is from Chicago, what's his thoughts on R. Kelly being found "not guilty"to the cheers of Black women?
That being said.... Why Jesse Why? Cut his ^%#$ off? You're smarter than that. I hope. I mean you could have given us a better soundbyte than that. I hope this was not a cry for attention because this is not the kind of attention you need. And Jesse had been doing so well. Al Sharpton has been running around acting a fool, but Jesse has been a trooper in stoic silence. Oh but my cynic-o-meter is going off. I just don't think this was an accident, but if it was intentional, why not give a better soundbyte.
Jesse's own SON had to issue a statement repudiating his own father:
"I'm deeply outraged and disappointed in Reverend Jackson's reckless statements about Senator Barack Obama. His divisive and demeaning comments about the presumptive Democratic nominee -- and I believe the next president of the United States -- contradict his inspiring and courageous career.WHOA. Um can I come to Thanksgiving dinner? Cause they ought to sell tickets. Pass that cornbread dressing!!
"Instead of tearing others down, Barack Obama wants to build the country up and bring people together so that we can move forward, together -- as one nation. The remarks like those uttered on Fox by Revered [sic] Jackson do not advance the campaign's cause of building a more perfect Union.
"Revered [sic] Jackson is my dad and I'll always love him. He should know how hard that I've worked for the last year and a half as a national co-chair of Barack Obama's presidential campaign. So, I thoroughly reject and repudiate his ugly rhetoric. He should keep hope alive and any personal attacks and insults to himself."
You Chicago people are off the chain. Rev. Wright. Father Pfleger. Jesse Jackson. Who else representing Chi-town wants next?
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Reader Comments (81)
Jessie Jackson told the truth, but he was crass. And yes, I'm very surprised that he didn't realize his mic was on.
When I hear Obama give white working class voters the "guns and religion" speech I'll be convinced the lectures aren't only saved for us.
What's wrong with you, Rev.? You're at Fox News! They live to hear black folks badmouthing each other. Did you learn from your mistake getting caught whispering anti-semitic stuff about Jews. Come on!
I am still miffed that he could not have come up with something more creative. That sounds like something a college frat boy would say. Jesse is like 80 years old. If he was going to say something controversial, then be more creative. He did so good for so long. I mean he only had to go 4 more months and he was home free.
Discipline!
Hey Gina,
This is so strange....strange indeed?????
A mic left on...hmmmm
I wonder if this was some grand orchestrated event designed to help Obama by showing the "old school negro rabble rousers" are not in his corner...making Obama more palatable for older working class whites.
I wonder...especially with the repudiation of his son in such a swift manner.
Lets marinate on that!
I agree with Jesse on this one(gasp). This man isn't Bill Cosby, he running for president of the United States. When I first heard the father's day speech, the first thing I said to myself was, 'uh-huh, he's trying to show the white folks he can be tough on the black folks, too.'
That being said, I wish Obama, Sharpton, Jackson and others could come up with something a little more thought provoking than the same old black folks need to raise their children speeches. Black churches have been preaching this for decades and it ain't working, because as with Obama, you're already preaching to the choir.
When I first heard the father's day speech, the first thing I said to myself was, 'uh-huh, he's trying to show the white folks he can be tough on the black folks, too.'
Yeah it got a lot of play in MSM, but that sermon wasn't anything revolutionary. If he wanted to be revolutionary, give a speech about the degradation of Black women. If he wanted to be revolutionary, forsake playing "I've Got 99 Problems but a b*tch ain't One" at campaign events. If he really wants to talk about healing the Black community, use the platform in Vibe, Ebony, Rolling Stone to come ou and condemn the objectification and degradation of Black women and girls in popular music, in stead of saying "I really feel bad about that, I "wish" I could let my girls listen."
So NAW, Black folks were not his audience. We might have agreed with what he said, but that wasn't why he said it.And you need to think LONG and HARD whether you want to set up a dynamic with the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES where he feels comfortable using the world stage to castigate on group of Americans by using well documented complaints within the community as a signal to all the other groups of Americans that he knows how to keep us in our place.
I know he can do no wrong in the eyes of many folk, but when he gets through RUNNING to be President, he is going to BE YOU President and this routine is going to get old. He has gone in front of other "ethnic" audiences and has made them campaign promises and issued them assurances that he wasn't going to take policy positions they disagree with, but when he got to US, we needed to "straighten up an fly right."
Again,
not disagreeing with the sentiments expressed as much as I am speaking about the motivation for expressing them in the first place.
It was a great speech that I've heard before and it was his Sistah Souljah moment. Ironically, Jesse was involved int he Sistah Soulah moment as well.
Gina, Obama knows he can't do anything wrong in the eyes of the majority of black folks. Just try to bring up how you disagree with some of his issues and see how folks jump down your throat. I still can't get over how some people jumped down Bill Cosby's throat and called nothing but an old pervert who doesn't know what he's talking about, but when Obama says it he's the new messiah. We as a community have to be careful about the contradictory messages we are sending out. Not only white people seeing it, but so are our children.
Personally, I really don't think this year is a strong Presidential race. I'm not very enthused by McCain either. I can take or leave either one of them. No one is taking about the real issues. It almost like a high school class president race.
July 10, 2008 6:50 AM
Can someone tell why Jesse Jackson was on Faux News anyway? Is he that desperate for camera time?
There is a rumor Jesse dropped the N-word. Time will tell if that's the portion of the tape Fox News did not release....yet.
Naima, see that's the contradictory attitude I am referring too. So now it's Fox News fault. I guarantee if he was on CNN they would've played it, also. In fact, Bill O'Reilly gets hated on for the saying the exact same thing Obama has said about black fathers taking responsibility for their offsprings.
Are we so caught up in liking the messager before we like the message. If so, we are in alot of trouble in the black community.
For example when we got all in up in arms when someone on Fox News called Michelle a baby mama, but when Condolezza Rice was called a cotton picker by Lou Dobbs on CNN we didn't say one word. I guess because we don't 'like' her it's okay.
Fox News is no worst than any other news outlet in the mainstream media. They are all just reporting the same stories over and over again anyway. This why I watch both CNN and FOX.
miss issues, I look at Jesse and Obama with the side eye, I am really not a big supporter of either one of them. I just don't know why a civil rights activist would even be on that racist network. They are not there to inform b/c people who watch that network have their mind made up already.
I guess I view Obama's father's day speech differently. If he solely wanted to take black folks to task and curry favor with whites, there are a million ways to do it. He could have talked about crime and our community's current glorification of thug/gun culture (shouts out to Lauren London!) Especially with the tough economic times, fear of black crime is the way you whip white folks up into a frenzy.
But instead he spoke on an issue that is deeply personal to him, absentee fathers. Could it be that maybe, just maybe, this really is an issue of particular concern for him? I mean, its not like he didn't deal with the issue himself and write a whole book about how f'ed up it is to have a father abandon you when you're two years old.
And if he wanted to throw black folks under the bus and get white folks on board--he would have attacked black women as well by using the "just close your legs" argument. But he didn't. He rested the responsibility for absent fathers on the men of all races. (man y'all ladies are tough--for the 1st time in the recorded history of black folks that a black-ish man didn't blame black male irresponsibility on black women, and y'all still mad at a brotha. I guess he just can't win).
The fact that he said three sentences specifically about how absentism is greater with black fathers (which in all the criticism of Obama's speech, nobody seems to dispute as a fact) doesn't equate to a Cosby/Sista Soldja moment to me.
Jesse may have a point?!?! SERIOUSLY? The thought that some of you on this blog may even agree a little bit with this divisive comment made be the "Great" Rev is appalling?!?!?
And to use Obama's father's day speech as a means to rationalize Jesse's egotistical remarks and attitude towards the senator is even more appalling.
"If he really wants to "challenge" the Black community how about giving a speech on sexism and misogyny"... Hmmm it seems to me that his "calling out" of black men (you know the very ones who continue to exploit black women) trumps giving a speech about the degrading of black women. I mean it's not enough just to say black women are being degraded, black women are exploited --umm we know this already, hence the meaning behind this wonderful website. However, why not target one of the problems to the exploitation of women - most of our men and their irresponsible behavior. I guess folks will never be satisfied.
I know this blog is "bi-partisan" and neutral but I wouldn't be surprised if there were some "closet Clinton supporters" still trying to hold on here...By the way, let me get this right we want Obama to give a speech about R Kelly?!?! Really!?! How about Rev Jesse give a sermon on this, he has ties to Chi-town as well. Oh wait..that may not work cause he is guilty of exploiting black women too! Did we forget that? It's sad day when some of us feel Jesse Jackson the adulterer, the corporate hustler, "told the truth"...sad, sad day.
I'm not ready to believe that Obama is turning his back on Blacks or our plight. His record speaks differently. Maybe for some people they expect big differences from him- not me. I realize he's a politician that happens to be biracial. He shouldn't have to choose sides. Hopefully he will make progress for the country as a whole- if he helps out one group of people in the process- great. As a society we must learn to make changes at a personal level with the hope of global affects in the future.
The state of Black America can't be fixed quickly; just by government; nor by the future President.
durtybertie and cinco...I totally agree and couldn't have said it better.
I listened to that Father's day speech many times. I loved it everytime I heard it. Nonetheless, I'm having second thoughts about the speech.
I was on a blog talk radio episode and it was a white caller who brought up the fact that Obama lectures black people but talks to whites. Everytime, Obama he sure to point out all the wrong things in our community and tell us what we need to do.
Obama has never told working class whites that they need to stop blaming minorities for their problems. He doesn't lecture them. Instead he stands up there and talks about how he's going to bring back jobs, his faith, patriotism. We don't get those speeches. We get the "You need to turn off the TV. You need to read a book to your children." I'm sorry but working class whites need to do the same things!
I'm sorry black folks but Obama will continue to throw black folks under the bus. That's the price of assimiliation.
Most of those working class whites who Obama is trying to woo will vote for McCain. Toothless Cooter and drunk SallyJean ain't gonna vote for no N-ger.
Obama has turned his back and there is countless, countless evidence which is why I left his campaign along with my friend.
I will still vote for him but no more state to state canvassing like I did this past year.
I am one who speaks about issues in the black community but I did not like Obama's speech nor did I like the language used.
On Father's Day of all the days, why must we yet again have to hear about the one's who are really not fathers.
Also why do we enjoy falling for the hype in regards to our community. Obama claims that the that rate of single parent households in the black community means that black men who are not in the home are either
1. Boys
2. Sperm donors
What kills me about Obama's "intelligence" is that since when has a man not being in the home mean that he is a "deadbeat". There is nuance behind the statistic. You cannot make that assumption. There was a study that came out that pretty much said that black men were more likely than other men of other races to take care of their children if they are not in the home. This is reason to celebrate along with the close to 50% drop in black teenage pregnancy. Why doesn't Obama go to the Latino community where they teenagers have the heighest and most alarming rates in regards to teenage pregnancy and large growths in single parent households. Why not go to the white community in regards to their over 50% divorce rate and the fact that they have 5 times as many single parent households (numerically).
However the not so brave Obama chose to perpetuate on a national and even global scale this image of dysfunctional black families and lazy, irresponsible and morally bankrupt black men. All in racist India there we headlines like "Obama Tells Black American Men to Stop Acting Like Boys and Act Like Men" with comments that were far more bigoted than what any white american could say. I grew up only knowing about black fathers who took care of their children. There was divorce in my family but those particular men still took up there responsibility even when they were divorced and no longer in the home. I resent this characterization.
The breakdown of the black family has many, many factors and historical origins.
What you see now with younger generations is that those who grew up in broken families and those who probably did not have their fahter in their lives growing up are seeing it as normal and are no empowered to break that cycle.
However as I said above, to make it black specific is wrong. The breakdown of families is an American problem and there is much evidence of this. I thought Obama was running for president of all Americans and not black America. Shouldn't he care about all families, fathers, mothers and children. If he grew up without a father and feels especially strong about this issue then why doesn't he speak to Americans on a whole.
I am sorry but I still resent the race neutral candidate going race specific. He has mouth for no one else. However he has mouth when it comes time to perpetuating the negative perceptions about the black community that are held for points. he sure got his round of applause from the Fox News Network.
Here is a news flash.... you can support, vote for, phonebank, canvass, and fundraise for a candidate and still reserve the right to criticize their campaign strategy.
Nobody said Jesse jacskon was a good person. I think the blog and the comments were clear that his statement was iditoic and stupid
HOWEVER, as annoying as Jesse Jackson may be, he isn't nearly as dangerous as the Black Thought Police who lord over the internet seeking to assasinate the character of any Black person that DARES to be so BOLD as to INFER that Barack Obama MAY have done or said something they disagree with.
For those who will walk in Kimberly's shoes and launch attacks on other commentors for having an opinion different from their own, let me save you the trounble because we've been down this ridiculous racil loyalty litmus test road before on this blog.
ANY PERSON THAT DARES TO COMMIT RACIAL HERESY AND CRITICIZE BARACK OBAMA IN ANY WAY IS:
A. A Hillary Clinton Supporter
B. A chitin-eating hankerchief head
C. An Uncle Tom/ Tomasina
D. A House Negro/ Negress
E. Self-hating Black Person/Negro
F. A Race Traitor
because it just isn't possible that they are a free thinking Black person who has a legitimatly held belief . uh uh, dissent is a character flaw.
Who knew that White Americans would be the only people who would be permitted to fully participate in the political cycle this year. Who knew that Black people would have to reamin muzzled.
To those that disagree with the criticism of the political "tough love" strategy, feel free to comment and disagree. I don't assume you have a character flaw or have ilintent just because we disagree on a single issue.
But I had to step in on this one because we established long ago on this blog that this character assasination by the Black Thought Police was not going to be tolerated ont his blog. Take your totalitarianism elsewhere. It is not welcomed here.
All readers Democrat, Republica, Green, Libertarian, or no party affiliation at all are always free to comment without having this tired "Hillary Supporter" aka "race traitor" nonsense thrown at them. The purpose of such attacks is to chill speech and silence Black people.
Your comments may be appalling to some, but the attacks are DISGUSTING TO ME!
Miss Issues said...
Naima, see that's the contradictory attitude I am referring too. So now it's Fox News fault. I guarantee if he was on CNN they would've played it, also. In fact, Bill O'Reilly gets hated on for the saying the exact same thing Obama has said about black fathers taking responsibility for their offsprings.
Are we so caught up in liking the messager before we like the message. If so, we are in alot of trouble in the black community.
For example when we got all in up in arms when someone on Fox News called Michelle a baby mama, but when Condolezza Rice was called a cotton picker by Lou Dobbs on CNN we didn't say one word. I guess because we don't 'like' her it's okay.
Fox News is no worst than any other news outlet in the mainstream media. They are all just reporting the same stories over and over again anyway. This why I watch both CNN and FOX.
****
Preach miss issues..PREACH!
You had me wanting to scream out 'Hallelujah' in my office. Every word you spoke was the truth.
Every word.
People are just upset that Obama is saying exactly what many white Conservatives say. And in the eyes of most black folks, 'white conservative' is synonomous with 'racist'.
I won't be voting for Obama but he is certainly on point in challenging our men and boys to do better. Because THEY CAN do better.
We expect more from them because they CAN do more.
Once again, miss issues, thank you for your post.
I have always said that if racist whites didn't try to take Obama down, then these liberal Civil Rights Industrial Complex "not black enough" chanting negroes most certainly would.
This only confirms what some have suspected- that the Civil Rights Industrial Complex doesn't really like the idea of an Obama Presidency. To them, he represents a new kind of Black leadership that might put them out of business. This is why so many of them supported Hillary Clinton for so long (and continue to support her).
And I also sense a little envy from the ultimate rider of coattails.... and Chairman of Civil Rights Inc. Jesse Jackson. This has been bothering him for a while - Obama stealing the spotlight.
This is just a continuation of the "you aren't Black enough" bull---. It's another way of saying it.
Whenever a Black person points out problems in so called "Black America", and points out the personal responsibility involved... or if they strive to do something great and they value education, he or she always ALWAYS comes under attack from the "Black Community". They must always deal with the majority of negroes turning on them and calling them Uncle Toms, not really black, claim that they are "acting white", that they want to be white, etc etc etc.
This reminds me of how I was treated by Blacks... BY BLACKS... when I was a youngster in school.... from 5th grade through my Senior year. Obama is going through the same thing right now (and I predicted that he would), only on a bigger scale. But I love how Obama has dealt with Civil Rights Inc. He has refused to bow down to them...and he deals with them on his terms. And they can't stand it.
Dealing with these negroes will be worse than dealing with John McCain and the Right.
Being Black is like being born with Cancer.... A cancer that never f-----g goes away. Because you constantly have to deal with this kind of bull----.
This is the first time that I can honestly say that I empathize with Obama. If he can fight off McCain and the Racist Right... that will be an impressive accomplishment indeed. But if he can fight off these negroes...especially the selfish, envious, backstabbing, corrupt, no good, conniving negroes who make up the Black elite, then he really will have my support because that will truly be a hard fought accomplishment.
Oh come on Gina...
That was a bunch of crap.... I have to cover my nose on that one.
Will every speech that Obama makes in a Black church be analyzed like this?
You all want Obama to be the Black Santa Claus and save the Black community with handouts.... but he can't comment on the conditions?
And guess what Black people.... he's not going to be able to save you from yourselves. He might make life a little easier...but he can't save you from the degenerate Black culture that is destroying your communities. (especially when he's not allowed to comment on anything concerning personal responsibility and such). All the government handouts in the World won't be able to save the so-called "Black Community".
I was a bit peeved when Barack made his comments over at Bishop Brazier’s church (Apostolic Church of God) on fathers day, BUT I got over it, simply because he was telling the truth in many (not most) cases of Black fathers. And the “many” is “too many”, so I agreed with Barack as I also agreed Bill Cosby when he said basically the same thing.
I believe I was initially peeved, because I am a Black man and a father of 4 and I am with my wife and taking care of my family, then I realized, that though it didn’t apply to me, it applies far too many times in the Black community.
I don’t think its “talking down” when it is the TRUTH. As they say: “If the shoe fits, say ouch and wear it”.
As for Jesse Jackson, Sr., the man is a clown, a caricature and a base buffoon, simple as that.
Gina, you know I have been a long time supporter of your blog and efforts but I have to respectfully disagree with you on this. You and I have both been lambasted and even referred to as "toms" for some of the stances that WE have taken, so how is it that Obama is talking down to Black folk in this instance? I am quite disturbed that legitimate critique of SOME of the pathologies that are afflicting the Black community equates to "talking down." We also know that Snoop Dog, Lil' Wayne and 50 Cent also "talk" to Black folk by calling us "niggas" "bitches" and "hoes" and they ask a sticker price for that right! I think this is about Black folks' over sensitivity as it relates to White people eavesdropping and this can not be with many factions within our community...well like Dr. Cosby has rightfully stated, "when your kids get out of school at 2:30 your dirty laundry is already hanging out." How exactly are we supposed to tell our Black men to step up? We have to start demanding correction and damn what white folk think...when you took your stance against BET, many Black folk on the net were hating, so I think Obama has to get a pass on this one.
Being Black is like being born with Cancer.... A cancer that never f-----g goes away. Because you constantly have to deal with this kind of bull----.
WOW, THAT IS VERY DEEP. These are some of the BEST comments I have ever read. The comments agreeing with the Rev. Jackson were a little surprising I have to admit. The fact that Obama is still holding up after the Rev. Wright blow up, after facing off with the Clintons, after taking hits on his wife's patriatism, after taking hits from black men like Bob Johnson who you would think would be on his side & now dealing with Rev. Jackson...How much fight is he going to have left in him to fend off McCain until November?? He is a strong black man with class and tact and when it is all over, he will still have those things. However alot of others will not (i.e. Jackson)
I am somewhat afraid to post this comment as I disagree with the sentiments of most of the commenters here; but WTH, here goes.
I personally do not take issue with Mr. Obama's comments on Father's Day or for the audience to whom they were delivered. I feel this way for one very simple reason: They were on point and being delivered to the audience to whom they are most pertinent.
Though I understand that those of you who feel the "lecture" was being given with the ulterior motive of impressing white "swing" voters may have a valid point and I agree that quite possibly that might have been the case, I still can't find my way around the fact that we in the black community need to find a way to address the state of our families. As the mother of an 18 year old son who is headed to college this fall and who I managed to rear and educate alone despite the fact that his father, [a college-educated black professional with not one but two degrees], made the choice not to be an active participant even though the state ensured he would be a financial participant, I feel that I can speak to this with authority.
Now I am in no way "male bashing" as I know women who do not have custody of their children and behave in just as callous a manner towards them. However, as a black, male figure who has come to great national prominence, I have to wonder if just maybe it was Senator Obama's hope that he might somehow influence even one black father to do the right thing. I ask those who disagree with this possibility to ask themselves if they would feel differently if they witnessed any "Joe Brother" (not a "celebrity") lecturing to others about living up to their responsibility would they take issue with it? I would think not as long as the "lecturer" was handling HIS responsibilities. Well, all of the evidence seems to demonstrate that as it relates to fatherhood, Mr. Obama is...so I ask again, why does his political standing dictate that he can't speak out on a social issue on which he appears to have some level of expertise?
When I was a child and would get into trouble with my mother for not having done a chore such as washing dishes, I would try to resort to the defense that last week when my sister didn't do her chore my mom had not reprimanded her. The thing that was true then remains true now, just because my mom chose for whatever reason to focus on my misstep and not my sisters did not excuse me from what my responsibility was. I say this to say that perhaps Mr. Obama should be "lecturing other audiences" regarding their shortcomings in the same manner that he has "approached" his black constituents; however, whether he does or does not in my opinion doesn't change the fact that we have issues in our community that need to be addressed and just maybe by adding his voice to others, he might help to move us closer to addressing them.
The fact of the matter is that all the ills that face us as Black Americans have some basis in our own ability to imagine the biggest life we can have. How I ask you will we ever be able to do that and subsequently have any chance of exerting social, political, and economical change as a group if we can't even be honest enough with our current short-comings to recognize that our families and our homes are where we must begin.
So whether the comments were said to flatter swing voters, impress the cameras, or for any other reasons, they needed to be said and they should be said again as often as they can be because as a sales professional I know that nothing motivates consistent change like repetition.
Said by one who supports Obama, but more importantly, one who supports right in whatever it comes and the ongoing glorification of her beautiful people.
Gina,
I agree with you 100%. Exactly what you outlined is the reason why I have been less frequent on the political black blogosphere. I am have been called all kind sof things for simply stating that Obama flip-flopped on FISA.
I did not agree with Obama's speech for the reasons that I outlined above.
1. I did not like the fact that it was race specific. If he is running for president of the U.S. then he should be speaking about the breakdown of the American family in general. However forget being race neutral when it comes to black audiences.
2. He made the assumption that a man who is not in the house = a deadbeat and I cannot agree with that assumption. There is nuance behind the numbers and Obama reducing a group of people to a statistic was not okay with me.
3. It was Father's Day, a day to praise fathers. I don't want to hear that there is no need to praise those who do what they are supposed to be doing anyway rhetoric because that means that it should be extended to the white, latino and Asian communities. If we as a society see it like this then we should get rid of both Father's and Mother's day because holidays are about praise. I was annoyed that once again the bad overshadowing all of the good when it comes to the black community. I have learned that people learn by example. When those who are not doing the right thing see those who are, they would probably have more of an incentive to change rather than they usual mocking and repudiating which changes nothing.
As you and many others said, Obama was not talking to "US" in that speech.
Lastly, I would like AA's to stop being so defensive and crazed when it comes to Obama and your consensual and unrequited love affair. You can support him and still be critical. It is called holding your leaders accountable. It is better to hold him accountable upfront than regreting not doing it later.
I also would have prefered Jesse Jackson to have went directly to Obama with his issues towards him rather than holding it in and letting it out at the wrong time and in the wrong place!
It is not like they have no connection. Jackson's oldest daughter Santita Jackson went tio school with Michelle and is the godmother of both Malia and Sasha. Jesse jackson Jr. is in Obama's campaign which means that he had avenues to contact Obama to voice dissent. Now that it was done in this fashion, it is creating drama that does not have to be there. The discussion is now counterproductive.
"They were on point and being delivered to the audience to whom they are most pertinent."
How?
Black churches never speak about family values and parenting?
The breakdown in the family is entirely exclusive to the black community?
Angry independent, a black professor once told me that being black is almost like being a communist. We are supposed to follow the same ideology and if you don't you're an 'uncle tom' or house n****ger.
Like Gina said, Okay we've heard the black folks ain't doing a good job speech, already. The Conservative Christian right has been saying this about this for years and so has the black church. What about some other issues? Give me the same speech on patriotism, NAFTA, and Iraq you give other audiences.
Do we really think Obama being president is majically going to change the black community overnight. Will his being president majically turned these bad black fathers around?
Of course not. If so then why haven't all the black mayors, govenors, senators, congressmen & women, police chiefs, firemen, surgeons, and college professor done the same.
For those of you who are in complete and blind defense of Obama's speech, can you tell me why he doesn't have a speech like that in front of Hispanics? Their men aren't stepping up the plate either? Their men have high incarceration rates? Why doesn't he talk about how the effects of illegal immigration are impacting the employment prospects of working class blacks? Why doesn't Obama tell underclass whites that they need to stop blaming minorities for their problems. They need to stop voting BLINDLY for Republican politicians who screw them the moment they get in office.
Obama defenders why doesn't he talk about job creation, patriotism, and the healthcare crisis in front of black audiences. HE DOESN'T! He tells us to turn off the TV, read books, go on diets!!!, watch our health, etc. But we NEVER get any kind of encouragement. Obama DOES NOT PROMISE BLACK FOLKS ANYTHING. But he makes a whole lot of promises to Hispanics and Whites.
Obama lectures, that's what he does. I'm not sure I agree that his lectures are only targeted towards one segment. A couple of examples:
Obama on white denial: "In the white community, the path to a more perfect union means acknowledging that what ails the African-American community does not just exist in the minds of black people; that the legacy of discrimination - and current incidents of discrimination, while less overt than in the past - are real and must be addressed"
Obama on rap: "I am troubled sometimes by the misogyny and materialism of a lot of rap lyrics"
Obama on media and anti-immigrant sentiment: "A certain segment has basically been feeding a kind of xenophobia. There's a reason why hate crimes against Hispanic people doubled last year."
I think black men who are good fathers who hailed from a home lacking the same have a certain vendetta against absentee dads. When I mentioned this debate to my husband, he said he just wished he had a podium and an audience of absentee black fathers. I know one commenter said all they knew coming up was black fathers caring for their children, but that commenter must be over fifty. Between me and my husband, we couldn't think of five people we knew whose father was in the home. Not five.
Believe me, I know the history and the reasons, etc. etc. ad infinitum. We act as if an admission that there is a crisis within our community is an admission of racial inferiority, so we're loathe to speak on it. In the meantime, black women are struggling to be father/mother/domestic worker/provider all on their own. But maybe it is time to call each other out.
Is Obama hoping to score points with whites? Sure. Is that his only, or even his primary motivation? I don't believe so.
Hey Rondacoco: You raised some good questions about the speech--especially in regards to the difference between being out of the house but active in rearing your kids and being a complete deadbeat. But, in listening to the speech, I assumed Obama was speaking to fathers not active their kids lives in particular since that is his own experience and he began the speech in the context of his own experience. Why do you assume he was talking to fathers active in their kids life?--it certainly is not in the actual text of his speech.
Also, at least at my church, folks generally tell a testimony based on their personal experience and relate to whatever the message of the day is. Obama's personal testimony is that of a child who knows first hand the hurt of having an absentee father. I think in a church and on father's day is exactly the time and place where such a testimony should be given.
I guess I don't see
the throwing people under the bus part of the speech. He devouted about as much time praising Michelle's dad and his brother-in-law (2 black men) as model dads as he did stating that there is more absenteism in the black community.
And also people seem to gloss over the fact that about half of the speech was devoted to ALL parents being more active in their kids lives and not letting the TV raise their kids.
Lastly, I don't understand the whole talk v. lecture distinction. Just yesterday Obama got in trouble for telling a predominently white crowd that they shouldn't be worried about immigrants learning english---they should be worried about why their kids only learn 1 language (unlike most other western countries). Was that a talk or a lecture?--and who decides which is which?
He was on point in his audience choice because to address an issue in the black community you need to address the black community. All this talk about this particular speech is tantamount to the old argument that "dirty laundry should not be aired in public". Look around, sure this is an issue across the spectrum of American society, but it is also an issue in Black America and that is to whom he chose to speak...in my opinion, because this is a group about which he cares and to which he identifies.
As far as the speeches on issues such as economics, the war in Iraq, the housing crisis, etc. I can only speak for myself but I can say this much for sure...I felt that I was just as privy to those as I was to this one seeing as I saw them ALL on TV or the internet and not one single one of them was entirely relevant to me, not even this one of which we speak. So stop picking and choosing what he is saying to US (meant specifically and collectively) and do what we all do everyday in life, take what applies to US and the rest for those for whom it was meant. After all, even the President (or in this case future President) of the United States of America can't be all things to all people all the time. You can't please all the people....
"Give me the same speech on patriotism, NAFTA, and Iraq you give other audiences."
But those topics weren't on the agenda on Fathers Day at the Church where he spoke. The speech was supposed to be about fatherhood, parenting, etc.
And HE HAS given the same speeches regarding NAFTA, Iraq, the economy, etc...to Black audiences. Are you ignoring his speeches in North & South Carolina, his speeches at the Black Colleges that he gave earlier in the campaign? Go back and see what was on the agenda at those events.
You all want it both ways.... On one hand you don't want him talking about the "Black Community's" dirty laundry...or any Black issues for that matter.... if he does... he's an Uncle Tom. But if he doesn't talk about these issues.... then he's ignoring the so-called "Black Community" and you raise Hell about that.
Monicka1st: Why doesn't he talk about how the effects of illegal immigration are impacting the employment prospects of working class blacks? Why doesn't Obama tell underclass whites that they need to stop blaming minorities for their problems.
=====================
I'm not sure how Obama can get away with blaming a minority group (mexicans) for black economic problems and turn around and tell whites NOT to blame minorities for their economic problems.
Also, why do you assume Obama doesn't talk about healthcare, the war, economic growth, etc. to Black audiences? Because he made one speech about fathers on........wait for it.....father's day?
Angry Independent beat me to it, but I was going to point out that he does address a broad range of issues when speaking to black audiences. The media loves to report on the moments when he addresses ills in our community, but that's not all he speaks on in front of a black audience. Here's an example:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=WVKxwECwRLE" REL="nofollow">http://youtube.com/watch?v=WVKxwECwRLE
Angry Independent, I don't want him to talk about black issues, hispanic issues, white issues. I want American issues. What about these corporations who hire illegal aliens knowingly so they can pay them a esser wage.
Likewise, I don't want Mccain to talk about those issues either. These men are running for President, not Moral Commander in Chief. If McCain said black men need to stop being trifling and feeding their children Popeye's chicken, I'd be on his case, also.
I have heard all of Obama speeches and they're just good political speeches. Not great, but good.
As black people we have to stop following this mainstream media message we are the only one lacking morals in the country. This whole country is lacking a moral compass. We need to tackle the overall mediocrity that is now driving this society. We need to demand more for our candidates than just feel good answers to tough economic and global questions.
McCain and Obama both are saying too much of nothing. Neither is qualified to be President of the US. Neither one them has stellar or even good senatorial records.
"I want American issues."
Exactly... I want the same thing. This is what I have been saying for months.
I wish we could bury the race nonsense and concentrate on issues important to the nation as a whole. (most of these issues intersect across racial lines anyway).
But the media wants to shape things their way.... for the biggest ratings draw. They have to create as many sensational stories as possible. Race has always been a winner when it comes to stirring controversy.
I'm with knockoutchick. It almost seems planned to help give Obama an edge among his white voters.
Jesse has been on TV too much to not know that mics are still on etc. He's trying to slyly help Obama.
while all this was going on, Cynthia McKinney chose activist Rosa Clemente as her VP.
history was made and ignored...
Apparently some of you blind Obama followers have not been listening to Obama's speeches. As I've stated in my previous posts Obama makes these "Get yourself together" speeches in front of black audiences only. NOT just his Father's day speech.
You simply fail to answer why he hasn't asked Hispanics and the white underclass to do the same thing? Can anybody point to a youtube clip, speech where he's telling white people about themselves? One speech about the impact of racism doesn't count. He was addressing a nation NOT group of people.
Again, I'm asking anybody on this board if they can point to a clip where Obama is in front of a group of underclass whites or Hispanics and he's laying into them like he lays into us? Anybody, Anybody.... can you answer that!!!
@brother Omni....
you just made me laugh.... lol
"I know one commenter said all they knew coming up was black fathers caring for their children, but that commenter must be over fifty. Between me and my husband, we couldn't think of five people we knew whose father was in the home. Not five."
Try 21!! I am usually the youngest person on most of these blogs. It may not be a reality to you but it was one for me. Just because something is a reality for you and people that you know have a vendetta does not mean that all must have to deal with that characterization. There is diversity in the black community like any other community. I grew up in a middle to upper class neighborhood which is probably why.
It was when I moved out to Brooklyn and began working in Fort Greene, Bed Stuy etc.. when I saw certain situations. I have spoken to various people to figure out the underlying causes. I believe that economics is a factor. It primarily effects those of certain socio-economic backgrounds. However to make it race specific is wrong.
Where I volunteer in Brooklyn most of the bad pathology is coming from the Latino community. However they deal with their issues constructively and rarely do they air out dirty laundry. However Latino pathology business has fewer gains unless it can be attached to illegal immigration which has nothing to do with Puerto Ricans and Dominicans in NY.
WHITE PEOPLE could listen to some parenting advice. As a nation, the breakdown of the family is an issue however it is easier to simply put it on one segment of the population like Obama did.
The discussion of black pathology became big business when white people along with some blacks figured out that they could use it to distract from the pervasiveness of social injustice, institutionalized racism and economic disaprity which contributed to many of the issues that we are now seeing in the first place.
I did a major project on the black family @ Columbia. I dealt with media, social trends, history, statistics, psychology, culture and interpersonal communication. I was once one to make sweeping accusations and simple-minded conclusions until I realized that there was more to it:
1. There is nuance behind statistics.
2. The interpersonal relationships between black men and black women are extremely problematic...extremely. There are various reasons for this and a big reason for a man not being in their child's life often has to do with the relationship with that child's mother. I find that too often, people let their personal relationships get in between taking care of their children in a way that is civil and responsible.
3. Strong families and marriages are built around those with financial stability and emotional statbility.
Amongst other things.
You see pointing figures due to personal bitterness cannot work. I am a womanist and I speak about women's issues but my intentions are never to demasculate black men or isolate them which creates more tension. The dialogue from all corners are always wrong.
Nonetheless, my biggest issue is that Obama made this race specific on a national stage. If he is running for president of America and not Black America then he should care about all American families right!
Here is an article that I would like to share:
http://www.newsweek.com/id/136335" REL="nofollow">O Father, Where Art Thou?
Brother Omi,
Rosa Clemente! Nice. I have worked with her over @ the Hip Hip Caucus.
I don't really care about what white folks and hispanics are doing. I just don't. I care about black folks and what black folks are doing and I am all for calling us/them out on their/our crap.
Jesse probably wanted to cut off Obama's nuts because Obama made a point; black children need fathers.
Jesse remember Karen Standifer and the illegitimate child you fathered with her while you were married? Is that why you wanna cut off Obama's nuts? Please spare us all and crawl back into ANY hole that will except you.
If black people don't want to hear those kinds of speeches then perhaps we should actually start doing better instead of always wanting to shoo the messenger.
Jesse has always been an idiot.
Rhondacoca is on point...
I think we're seeing Obama's own fatherhood issues being played out before all of us.
He doesn't mean what he says anyway: one minute he's castigating Black fathers, next minute, he's hanging out with Jay Z, who's made some of the most anti-Black woman music ever made.
Jay Z says in his music that "Black women don't know how to act"...if you're a fan of Jay like Obama is, wouldn't that lyric justify Black men leaving their families?
Obama gets more confusing everyday... criticism of him is correct - it's just that Jesse "That's My Baby Daddy" Jackson has no cause to talk...
...or whisper, in this case.
As much as I hate to say this, I have to agree with AngryIndependent on this. I hate racist White people and to hear them makes me proud as hell to be Black. But, as a Black person, Black folks are the ones that really make you hate other Black folks. Mr. Obama will have no choice but to pander to White folks if he wants to win. Some of you Black people, just like some of these White racists, are looking any little thing to discredit him. We got thugs in the hood, killing, robbing, and whoring who get more support than Barack Obama. No wonder we don't get better. We don't want better.
This is the first real shot that we have at having someone that looks like us and has had similar experiences as us as President of the United States. Yet we can't wait to tear him down. He isn't perfect, but maybe, just maybe he can pave the way.
That's alright you all go ahead and vote for McCain or keep wishing and hoping that Hilary miraculously will get the nomination. Of course they care about Black people and do everything in their power to cure everything that ails Black America without giving a lecture or pointing a finger.
Sheryl, HUH?!
No man would listen to you talk if he didn't know it was his turn next. ~E.W. Howe
Even if Rev. Jackson's mic wasn't on, in today's day and age, that snippet would have gotten out. Sooner or later. Ask anyone who has had their dirty laundry aired on Youtube, Myspace, Facebook, or Blogs...
It is very possible, even probable, that the problem of absentee fathers is a class-based issue; the problem is more common among lower-income than higher-income families. However, African-Americans are disproportionately lower-income. As a result, issues that are related to class such as violent crime, accessible housing, single-parent households, etc. become the prevalent issues within and experienced by African-American households, citizens, and communities. I don't doubt that there exists many African-American households headed by two-parent families; my own household happens to be one of them. But that is not the reality for the majority of African-American mothers and children. And while all races are represented within the lower-class, and therefore all races deal with the issues relevant to that class, the fact that so many African-Americans are economically disadvantaged means that most African-Americans will disproportionately struggle with the reality of a broken family structure.
Let me add here that my own family was upper-middle class prior to our becoming a single-parent household, after which my father was, indeed, absent. We then became a lower-income family. Class ascension is no guarantee of a two-parent household.
To point to the fact that all races deal with the pathologies disproportionately affecting African-Americans, and to use that as an excuse to refrain from studying this issues in a racial context may be doing a disservice to African-American women and children who need real talk and real solutions. I don't know. This is a really interesting conversation, though, and I'm glad everyone is taking the time to add their observations and experiences to the mix.