Thursday
Jan312008
Detroit to Kwame.."Why Can't We Quit You"--- Why Carlita Stays...
Thursday, January 31, 2008 at 11:23PM The Blogmother Kwame is still a mess and Carlita just looks medicated or something. Watching this I felt extremely uncomfortable and bad for her. I have spoken with others that say she chose this life. I don't care about Kwame, but if we can put aside out sanctimony, I wonder for real why some women make the decisions that they do about their relationships with men.
Something deeper than == Low self esteem or stupidity. We've seen lots of cases on this blog about women introducing men into their lives who go on to abuse and kill their children. So putting aside out Kwame rage for a moment. Why stay? Why hold his hand? Why share in his public burden?
Um Carlita it ain't between the three of yall if he used his position as mayor and city resources to cover up his scandalous ways.
Are there some things worth preserving? Just wondering. No judgement. Is it something more than selfish and neediness? What of Christine Beatty? Why settle for a piece of a man? Share some wisdom people!
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The church that people attend can influence how women deal with unfaithful men. The one I grew up in it was almost expected that men were weak and needed to be forgiven when they strayed. Unfortunately the same grace was not given to women that messed up. Women are the ones that supposedly help men be good so the tolerance for crazy behavior is high. This puts undue pressure on women to stand by men that are not worthy of their respect. In this scenario the wife was always to blame if their husband strayed (ii.e. you did not have what it takes to keep your man happy or else he would not tip out). It would not surprise me if some of this dynamic is in play with his wife. I have seen that look too many times on wives in the church growing up.
Carlita is not medicated and she is not stupid. She's making a conscious decision. If you lived in Detroit (as I have) or if you know somebody who does and talk to them, they will tell you that the Kilpatrick family is a machine. People that cross them , your reputation will be destroyed, and if you believe the Manoogian Mansion party story, crossing them can even get you killed (look up Tamara "Strawberry" Green). The business community is getting paid even as Michigan and the city go through some of the roughest economic times ever seen, but Kwame is helping the business community get paid. They are embarrassed, but they don't want anyone gumming up the works, like the President of Council who becomes mayor if Kwame quits. So they are keeping their mouths shut. Even Gov. Granholm is quoted in the paper today saying scandal should not stop the work from going forward. Thats why Kwame made a point of saying in his Mea Culpa that he was in charge, to let folks know that as long as he is in office, their good times would keep rolling. He's corrupt, his staff are corrupt. He lies, and he gets other people to lie for him as well. Carlita is part of that and all the benefits such as the $450,000+ house they bought in Florida, his thuggery in office brings. And just like Hillary, she stays in it for the benefits.
Wow, talk about the love of money being the root of all evil. It looks like mess like that is in many cities. I have seen the same.
This isn't about a woman be being stupid, medicated nor about staying for the money or reputation. It should be about the covenant that a woman and a man make to each other and hopefully before God and with God when they say I do. Covenants are not something that should be taken lightly or easily broken. Now let me be clear I am not advocating that a woman stay in an abusive relationship that isn't scriptural or biblical. What I am simply saying (if it can be simply stated) At some point in time in a marriage, after the rose-colored glasses fall off and the hollywood notion of love fades to black, a couple has to face what love really means. It also means that you have to accept the fact that each of you are human and each of you are going to mess up at one time or another and that you want to be able to be forgiven for your mistakes, learn from them and grow. The mistake that people so often make, is judging another person's relationship and decisions. We cannot look at a part of their marriage or any one else's and decide that the part defines the whole marriage. That is short-sighted. While we tend to want to deem one sin greater than another, a sin is a sin, is a sin... Now a spouse can choose to walk a way and "cast the first stone" or they can choose to walk through it together. We can't fault this woman for standing by her man because we don't know the sum and substance of their marriage. While it seems that his actions are unforgivable... "Let he/she without sin..." I pray that more adults take the time to examine the whole marriage and situation before just walking away...somethings that get broke can be fixed.
I'm not even going to comment on the Kilpatrick family machine because there are so many "machines" in politics, including and especially the White House, that it's amazing that common folk even voted for these people. It has been for a long time and forever will be.
I thought his speech and the language that he used in describing his affair with Ms. Beatty as a "mistake" as just another example of a person separating himself from any personal responsibility. How can you mistakenly carry on an affair for years and lie under oath about it? And how do you mistakenly fall into bed time after time with someone? It was so Bill Clinton-esque: "between me, my family and God." Where was God when you, according to your text messages, got busted?
As for Mrs. Kilpatrick, I'll only say that I feel very, very sorry for her because the revelation of infidelity in your marriage, public or private, is a very deep place to be. If she did look medicated or deer-caught-in-the-headlights-ish, then it's probably because she, as the woman, has to clean up the mess that her husband is making, and it's just the beginning. That means holding your head up when being judged (and called all kinds of names) for standing by someone like Kwame, making sure that reporters aren't following you and your kids around to catch any weak moments for the front page(s), making sure that the kids don't injure themselves when they come home from school because their schoolmates have been teasing them mercilessly because daddy made a "mistake" and and all the other crap that I can't even imagine that comes with public scandal. Not to mention that Pimp Kwame hasn't even gotten to the point where he's discussing perjuring himself on the stand. That, as Oprah would say, is another show.
It's really true: the church you attend has a great deal to do with how you handle a conflict/crisis in a marriage. A lot of traditional black churches teach women to be submissive to men and to accept almost any behavior (including abuse) if he says he's sorry and apologizes. This free pass is given in the name of "forgiving" someone for their "sins."
We should be extremely cautious about the people we allow to speak into our spirits.
It seems the question never arises as to why someone who is worthy of our love and respect would treat us this way. But of course, we're taught not to be too picky and to just be grateful we have someone, even if he is disrespectful and mistreats us.
Perhaps Mrs. Kilpatrick has figured out that it's a bad idea to cross a politically powerful family; that her children would suffer immensely if the marriage broke up; that her standard of living would go down for a long time, etc. So, like a lot of other women, she stays.
I just wonder how Kwame explained his time in a North Carolina resort with another woman during the Martin Luther King holiday. That just happened a few weeks ago.
if he was so sorry then why doesn't he pay the 9 million out of his pocket vs.the taxer payers footing the bill for his b/s yet again...
and for carlita and her privacy...it's not private when it's my money that's involved. don't talk to me about being committed to him when CLEARLY he was NOT committed to you.
The church and how a woman is raised can influence her to stay in a bad marriage. But God gave you common sense. Yeah, you can stay in this marriage, keep living in your big house and turn your head every time your husband leaves the house. But what example is she setting for her children. Are you telling them to put aside their dignity and self respect just to say you're married. Too many people stay in bad marriages out of fear. Fear of not being alone and not being able to find someone else.
This was not a simple affair and this is not a mistake. Affairs are not mistakes. This man loved and cared for that other woman. He made sure she had a good paying job and big house. She was not as they say a 'jump off'.
Like Deborah said, this woman is staying for her own selfish reasons. Just like Kim Porter stays with Sean Combs.
And if Carlita had the affair will he be so forgiving? Carlita needs to take a page of Sheila Johnson's book. A woman who truly loves herself will get the man she deserves.
And let's not forget how a lot of black churches drilled the idea into a woman's head that if she's divorce her husband she can never get married again.
My own abusive (now) ex- husband, who never went to church, knew that particular scripture. Good thing I had role models of women who left abusive marriages and now are happily married again. They gave me the strength to know has better for me.
I think the problem is, as I say on my blog, women don't understand the meaning of love. Love is reciprocal. It's a give and take. Love is not long-suffering and sacrificial. If I love you, you must love me equally in return. Love is not supposed to make you feel insecure, humiliated, or embarassed. If it does, then it is not love. How is something a "mistake" when you do it repeatedly? How do you cheat on someone you love? The answer is you don't. If Carlita understood the meaning of love then she would know that she is in a loveless marriage. She would know that she is living a lie.
I can't judge her or her circumstances but I don't think that I could ever feel the same about a man who violated the vows of our marriage by cheating on me. I'm not gonna lie and say that I wouldn't love him anymore, but it would never be the same. Without trust, there can be no love. What's the point of having a husband if you have to always wonder if he's being unfaithful?
Now a spouse can choose to walk a way and "cast the first stone" (snip)
I'm no longer a religious person, although I did grow up in the black church. That said, I disagree with the above quote because it implies that Carlita would be overly judgmental or somehow in the wrong for choosing to end the marriage. No, she absolutely would not. I don't understand why some women remain in such marriages or relationships, despite the "benefits." She is no exception.
At the end of the day, she chose to stay, so that's her business. But "casting the first stone" isn't connected to walking away from a bad marriage, IMO. "Casting the first stone" would be Carlita constantly throwing Kwame's affair(s) in his face, whether or not she stayed with him. I don't know if she's doing that or not, but it certainly wouldn't be wrong to leave him. Frankly, if she had the courage to do that, I'd high-five her all the way - it has to be immensely difficult to walk away from a situation like that, for your own mental/emotional health, as I have no doubt that most, if not all, in their inner circle probably advised her to stay. You know, cause a brotha is doing the best he can, he's sorry, you can't leave him during this time of crisis, blah blah typical self-sacrifical for the "greater good" BS.
As WIT stated, having an affair (or multiple affairs, possibly?) isn't a mistake. It's a bad choice, decision, course of action, etc, but claiming it's a mistake seems to shirk personal responsibility. The apology was half-hearted, at least as seen. Whatever. I gathered the true purpose of that broadcast was to let folks know that he was still in charge. He just prefaced it when that half-baked apology/pseudo-acceptance of responsibility to make the pill easier to swallow.
Well, my two cents. Having been previously married I feel that most (not all) folks marry for different reason and love is usually last. I also believe that when you are married you will have to put up with something. You have some men who love to gamble, love sports, love video games, love to cheat, love to do drugs, love to watch porn, love to go fishing etc…) The point is nobody is perfect and it all comes down to what your willing to accept. So to me Carlita is willing to accept her husband is a cheater. So be it. It’s her marriage and good luck. My only problem with the situation is that his cheating ways cost the poor taxes payers of Detroit 9 million dollars.
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I think that a lot of people forget that men that are this treacherous 'condition' the women that they are with to accept it.
This kind of prolonged, sustained adultery is not a 'mistake'. Call it what it is: ABUSE.
People like this already know what to look for in a wife: low self esteem, poor family support systems, gratitude for being 'chosen', and financial dependence.
Often times they play a lot of head games to keep the spouse on the defensive. So by the time their crap is out in the open, their spouse is so spiritually and emotionally wounded, that they don't have the defense systems in place to really deal with the situation.
That is why women should ALWAYS:
1) HAVE THEIR OWN MONEY. Get an education and be able to feed yourself, even if your plan is to become a homemaker. Have a private emergency account. My mom had saved tens of thousands of "emergency" dollars in a secret account opened by my grandfather on her wedding day. She gave the money to my dad on their 30th anniversary as gift, for being a faithful and loving husband.
2) Keep a good relationship with your own family. My father would demand that I came home and leave this joker. There would be no arguing. My two brothers would have packed my stuff and said I was leaving. My dad already told my brothers in law that he didn't spend his life sacrificing for his daughters, for them to be mistreated by anyone, including their husbands -- and that ain't no joke.
3) Form your own identity. It's wonderful to love your husband with all of your heart, and to be "one" with him.. but if he becomes "THE" one, and you are simply "the appendage", then you are in a world of trouble if your husband isn't a man of integrity.
For those that take a narrow view of what the Bible says about divorce and remarriage she has every right to leave and remarry because he was unfaithful to her. For whatever reason she has decided to stay for now after repeated indescretions. I just wonder what how their sons are dealing with this. I just hope that they do not grow up thinking that they can do anything and get away with it. I cannot get past what the impact of this will be on the children. However the children did not ask to have a cheater for a father and one in the public eye. I'm convinced that his wife was either worn down before they married or became that way afterwards. It is evident that she feels she has no support at this point.
My guess is that the unnecessary loss of funds for the city of Detriot might spell the end of his career. At least I hope in this case that the careless loss of funds by this 'man' will provoke them to indict and prosecute him. Since he boldly said in his speech that he was in charge he is fully responsible for what goes on in Detroit. Let him take responsibility either by seeing the light(not likely) or by force.
The local NBC affiliate station just announced that (according to the mayor's office)Christine Beatty will not receive a severance package from the city. So, she is literally out without a dime.
Are they serious? Wait a minute,is he serious?
He really needs to resign. Not because he had an affair. Call me a cynic but most elected officials probably have affairs and it doesn't affect their ability to govern.
He needs to resign because 1) he had an affair with a subordinate he opened the city to sex harassment suits and now wrongful termination suits. 2) He used city resources to cover up this affair. 3) He perjured himself when he denied that the two were having an affair. As a matter of fact, he resented the the implication.
If he could tell such a bald faced lie about this, one can't help but wonder what else he lied about.
You know what else, that Tamara Green just adds fuel to the fire. Why is the mayor having stripper parties? Was security provided by city police.
it's just something to think about.
Angela said: "The mistake that people so often make, is judging another person's relationship and decisions. We cannot look at a part of their marriage or any one else's and decide that the part defines the whole marriage. That is short-sighted. While we tend to want to deem one sin greater than another, a sin is a sin, is a sin..."
very well said. it is so easy to judge what their situation may appear to be now, but this is just a peek that we've gotten into their relationship. and it certainly is NOT the only factor in a marriage.
when you get married, there are many vows that you take, so why should this one be so decidely the end? should one leave when they don't feel cherished? also, love is long-suffering and it does not keep a record of wrong-doing. (See Corinthians 13:4-6; King James Version)...she has her own mind and for whatever reasons, she made a decision. whether or not i (or anyone) agrees with it or understands it doesn't matter. while his affair was just that, an affair (not a mistake), who's to say that carlita must suffer from low self-esteem or other extenuating factors, besides that fact the SHE upholds her marriage vows and forgives her husband for his indescretions?
I think what some have pointed out is the inconsistent way to command to "not keep a record of wrong doings" is applied to women who are taught they cannot leave men who are habitual adulterers, etc. This does have a larger impact on our communities.
Of course, Mrs. Kilpatrick is free to do whatever she wishes with her situation.
I am waiting for the day when preachers will stand in the pulpit and tell married men to accept and forgive their wives for having multiple "affairs." This is what women are often told to do in traditional churches that like to use Scriptures to support an unscriptural lifestyle of serial adultery.
I'll be shocked if that day will ever come. I wouldn't hold my breath. Too many of them will advise wives to stay with their physically abusive husbands because 'they would not beat them if they were good wives'. Yes I know one or two gals that were given that advice when they went to their pastors. It will be a rare male preacher that will do that. The love of money is the reason.
@Pamela: You are right and I will not hold my breath.
I just cannot understand why (in this day of HIV and everything else) anyone would encourage a woman to stay with a man who habitually breaks the marriage covenant by committing serial adultery.
We are setting a very low standard for ourselves and we will pay the price now and in the future.
Let me just commend everyone in this thread for being so mature and non judgmental. I have been pleasantly surprised by the level of discourse.
I just think Carlita is a mirror. Depending on wher eyou are and where you've been and where you're going, ou will view the situation in different ways.
I just want to know what kind of city has a 'city-owned Escalade?' Who the hell is running that town? Snoop Dogg? Damn Detroit, try, just try to get some dignity about yourself.
I'm curious about Mrs. Kilpatrick state of mind and commitment to her husband now that more allegations of infidelity have been presented.
LMAO @ Rosyln. I bet Snoop and Phone Bone KilpaTRICK have kicked it HARD when he comes through Detroit.
Hard question to answer because it varies from woman to woman. Both Christine and Carlita are probably greatly attracted to the power. Power makes a man sexy - especially for women that crave prestige themselves. Being associated with that makes them feel better about themselves.
While I do think there are larger issues as to the reason that Carlita is staying (which Aaron and Alaine have alluded to), I do find that for a lot of women, it's definitely a self esteem issue. I have two beautiful friends that feel ugly on the inside, which leads them to continuously make bad choices in men. I get so exasperated with them both. Nothing but God and some time on the couch will help them.
I've expressed my outrage on my blog several times about these women that put their children second and take up with these fools that end up raping and/or murdering their kids (little Da'Niyah Jackson comes to mind). To me when there are children involved, it's not about you and what you want. Is Carlita thinking about what kind of message her staying is sending to those three BOYS that she is raising - particularly since he is still out humping around even after all this? Somebody needs to think about those kids! Now watch he pulls the Eric Benet defense.
Kwame "Phone Bone" KilpaTRICK got the "side eye of the week" award on my blog today for his foolishness. It's not even about the wanderings of his bedroom eye. That would have been between him and Carlita (as I'm sure they have an understanding) had he not made this a public matter with his storied shenanigans. As another poster said, it's about how his lies clost this depressed city millions. He definitely feels a sense of entitlement but every dog has his day. You got to pay for what you do.
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Considering that Carlita has children to raise and shouldn't wanna catch any STDs, shouldn't have to be made to feel like shit, and shouldn't have to be put through public humiliation, I think she should leave.
Especially for her kids. What can they take from this debacle? To be smarter at cheating than their father? Her kids must really be going through it.
And it's a shame how Christine's life is pretty much over while Kwame can fall back on his moms connects since she obviously hasn't cut the cord yet.
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I'm sure there are many reasons pro and con. If Ms. Carlita has an active practice of religion then I know all too well the teachings that influence her decisions. I was married 20+ years; brought up in the 'Apostlic Doctrine' (with generations of Deacons' preachers, and Evangelists); 5 daughters resulted from our union... When I went to my Pastor for the first time in 20 years and 'complained'about the YEARS of financial liabilities
I'd suffered because of my ex- husband- his advice was to come to church more and to keep paying my tithes.
He didn't want me to take my ex to court for our two minor children; never mind the fact that after 20 years he wouldn't support his girls willingly. It was then I realized that the 'long suffering mentality of women that are 'saved'- was no longer for me. I apoligized to my daughters when I initially filed for my divorce- for the examples I had shown them that would forever influence their views on women, men, relationships, marriage, finances, religion and common sense...
As previously said here- it's less about Mayor Kwame and Ms. Carlita- and more about what impact what's heard and what's done will have.
Its not easy...but it can be done!!!
It's amazing what the church will advise you to do.
When I used to go to church, one of the members was in the process of divorcing her husband. She was in the US with her kids and her husband was in Jamaica. She was gonna file for divorce cuz her husband went and married another woman while he was still married to her.
Can you believe that the pastor advised her to stay married and work it out? He even called for the church to pray for them not to get divorced. SMH.
http://anonymissblog.blogspot.com
Some of us still take for better or for worse seriously. And I'm not even a church goer. I think it says hella more about us when we fight to keep it together. The collapse of the marriage = the collapse of the traditional family which = the collapse of traditional values, morals and governance. The scarlet letter the mayor will wear is his alone. She can move forward in peace, supporting her husband and maintaining the family unit without embarrassment or scorn. Need more sisters willing to fight for it.
His wife is grown and can decide what she wants to do. She has no marriage because time and time again the vows have been broken with no consequence from her. If she wants to stay with him that is her business but it is not just about her but the well-being of her children. No one on earth can believe that a scenario where a father can break the marriage vows at will is a good scenario for children to be raised in. I have known people that were raised in this situation. They are still damaged because of it. They either turned out like the adulterer or have total hatred for them. To have this happen where everyone knows about it is horrible. Again she can do what she wants to. That is her decision. If she truly feels like she is keeping something together I truly feel sorry for her. She has nothing but a child for a husband because no one will confront his unacceptable behavior. Since his wife at this point has not demanded change from him he has permission from his wife to continue it. That is not a marriage. Again if that is what she wants to do that is her business. It's really sad for their children because they did not ask to be born in a house full of chaos.
"Need more sisters willing to fight for it."
What we really need is more MEN willing to "fight for it." More men who will fight and defeat the temptation to cheat, lie, abandon their families, and disrespect their wives and children.
We should absolutely insist there is no virtue in being a forever victim. When we chose the forever victim role, we are teaching our sons they don't have to be responsible and we are teaching our daughters they are less important.
Perhaps that belief has already won out and that is why so few want to hold men equally responsible for keeping their families together.
I honestly believe it is brainwashing and conditioning that begins for Black women when we are little girls. It is enforced throughout our teen years, and by the time we are in our twenties, BINGO. Mission acomplished. The mission being to keep us slaves to "Men" like this sorry fool. I have had experiences with sistas raised outside of certain circles, and this self-destructive behavior is a mystery to them. So that tells me it is cultural above all else. It is learned behavior. And if sistas could be taught to love ourselves and look out for our OWN best interests from when we are little girls, I believe this would be a non-issue.